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Post by Kelly on May 1, 2008 1:16:00 GMT -5
My theory is she and Jimmy were getting jiggy, Ducky walked in so he was forced to hide her in one of the autopsy drawers and forgot to let her back out
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Post by della on May 1, 2008 6:21:05 GMT -5
I’m not a fan of when they split up the team, where one part is separated from the other part by such a distance, however, I have to say that there was such a lot about this episode that I really, really liked. The plot was so involved, and I was still clueless until the reveal, just how I like my mysteries. Anyhow... LOL! That beginning was hilarious. McGee’s “Hey!” when Ziva punched the piccie to be shown on the big screen made me laugh out loud. It wasn’t quite as affronted as McGee might have been in earlier seasons and on that, I really like the way they’ve moved the character on from being so sensitive to someone who can see a comical situation, even when he might be the brunt of it. ...And the keyboard sequence had me in fits of laughter. Cute doggie sounds. I would have kept them, well, at least for a little bit. LOL! Hmm, what’s Leon doing there? Wouldn’t Jen have been reinstated after the La Grenouille investigation? I knew she'd been relieved of duty, but I thought it had only been for the duration of that investigation? *shrug* Not that I'm complaining mind. I really like Leon and he has slipped into place with such ease. I really liked Nikki in this episode. I liked the reason why she desperately needed to go to Baghdad. Her reason in this episode was very much like Monk’s when we first got to know that character on-screen – His reason to try and overcome his OCD was to get back on the force, something that meant/means(?) a lot to him (I don’t watch it anymore). Nikki’s reason for trying to overcome her OCD was because of her Brother and I have to say that I’m a real sucker for such noble sentiments where someone has to overcome such personal difficulties to achieve them. It’s a shame she didn’t take her moment of satisfaction with Ziva, because I’m pretty sure Ziva would have done so with Nikki – chuckle. But hey, that’s just childish. So good on her for not doing that. Way to go Nikki!! ...And yeah, I have to agree with the person who mentioned they did a double-take on Ziva and the way she wore her hair. I did the same thing. It was slightly bemusing to me to be honest, because I can’t recall her ever wearing her hair that way, or wearing such a feminine looking blouse,in comparison to the fatuigues and harsher tones to her clothing. A complete transition from fighting machine to feminine in two seconds flat. Weird – chuckle. I suppose the burning question is “When did Tony go to Iraq, when the background for him has been given all along as someone who was a detective, not a Marine?” *shrug* Not really happy with the lack of explanation. Could have done with a Gibbs explanation to Leon why it would be better for him to remain in the US. Then there would be no question that the reason Tony went was because of his seniority, or that Gibbs recommended him. Not that important though, just something that would have been nice, especially if Gibbs had recommended Tony. LOL! “Can I go to the bathroom really quickly?” “No” (sits back down) “Nah I’m kidding, you can go” Gibbs and his sense of humour LOL! Poor Stenner... that scared huh – chuckle. and given the end, I can see why now I also have to say that Michael Weatherly did look very nice indeed in the Uniform, with sunglasses. And I particularly liked the unshaven look too *ahem* Anyhooo... LOL! “Never thought it was possible to hurt yourself with a wet wipe” Oh my goodness. These one-liners coming thick and fast really had me in fits of laughter. I adore NCIS humour, and this episode was jam-packed full of it, which was such a wonderful surprise, because I had been expecting a slightly dirge of an episode. Kind of heavy duty and full of meaningful, possibly Propaganda-ish messages, and yet it was so far from that. Lovely! However, “This is Baghdad, the whole place is a crime scene” – the one and only real message and a good one at that. As for Nikki hugging the young girl, the way I viewed it was that the young girl was a member of a family Nikki had already said she would never be able to repay for what they had done for her Brother, so I think she returned the hug over her fears because of the debt she owes the family. She might have freaked out about it later, but not in front of them. I thought that was such a good scene. Also, it might be that what happened to her Brother could have triggered Nikki’s OCD in the first place, and yet going back to Iraq, to the place where it all happened, and meeting the family of those who tried to help him, maybe it’s the first step in her recovery and maybe why she could hold her Brother’s hand at the end? Either way, I hope Nikki does become a regular, or more of a regular than she is now, because that was one heck of a background they gave her and an intriguing one too, in my opinion And lastly, ending on Otis Redding. Oh yeah, inspired. I loved it. All in all, I thoroughly enjoyed this episode. I also thought it was as good as last week’s, maybe better, but for entirely different reasons. Sooooo... bring on the remaining episodes. I can’t wait!
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Post by sheep on May 1, 2008 9:56:37 GMT -5
Except not all promotions are like that, which makes it a catch-22. I sincerely doubt Gibbs applied to be a team leader when he transferred to D.C., because he doesn't seek out management positions. Higher-ups noticed his record and put him in that position. But perhaps he would have gotten there quicker if he'd asked for transfers/promotions - like how Jenny managed to become director by putting her career on the "fast-track." She was his subordinate, after all. Not to mention that we can't assume Gibbs wasn't offered promotions prior to DC. You can make plenty of valid choices to get yourself noticed or you can sit at your desk waiting for someone to tell you that you did a nice job - while doing what is expected of you in your job. "I wanna go to Baghdad" isn't the same as asking for a promotion. It's demonstrating initiative. Just wanting to stay in one's position is no excuse. You want to stay in the same position, fine, but never looking beyond it makes you seem unmotivated. And it's not like McGee's next presumptive promotion (senior field agent? team leader?) would take him out of the field. Tony wanted to stay in his position and just said no when a promotion was offered to him. He still went above and beyond on Operation: Frog. By not even volunteering for the Baghdad mission, McGee made himself look foolish and threw his teammates under the bus - "Oh, that sounds dangerous. Why don't you do it?" Not that I think this is what McGee was saying, but I could certainly see Vance interpreting it that manner. As for the Nikki/OCD stuff - I don't think there's one right interpretation because the writers are going for the pop culture definition rather than the clinical, DSM-defined one. They just randomly decided when she's going to be affected.
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Post by auralynn on May 1, 2008 11:21:08 GMT -5
Speaking for myself alone I don't think my "dislike" of Nikki is based on her being a woman.
I have posted about the reasons I personally dislike her before, but I'll try here to explain it better.
Agreed that Nikki is trying to overcome her OCD is admirable. Hey I've had some problems with "checking" behavior myself which is also considered a part of OCD.
Too Nikki may have good reasons for her behavior, that we don't fully understand yet, and her "condition" maybe exxagerated, and may indeed be temporary. She also as has been pointed out may be acting as she does to protect her brother's immune system. So Kudos to her for that selfless motivation, but here is the reason my sympathy for her is lessened by miles.
As I think I may have posted in another thread, and taking Monk as an example, as another poster has done in this tread too: that show's Captain Stottlemyer pointed out: Other officer's lives are often dependent on the skill and bravery of their backup, so he could not justify testifying on Monk's behalf to offically reinstate him as a gun carrying officer.
No matter how much the Captain admired Monk's detecting abilities, and cared for him as a friend, he couldn't take that kind of risk with his other fellow officers lives. The chance that one of Monk's fears would cause him to hesitate if only for a split second and put someone else in danger as a result was just too strong.
Does any believe that Gibbs would have any less consideration for his agent's safety than Stottlemyer did for his officers? Come on this is Gibbs we are talking about here. If the writers were staying true to his charcter, he would have had a fit about her being chosen, IMHO. He would have gone to the wall before he let anyone take that big of a gamble with Tony's life. So the writers tried to show she could cope, but Gibbs and Tony didn't have that reassurance going in. So he couldn't have substituted Ziva because she is Israeli but surely he would have suggested Magee instead.
If Nikki was a truly selfless individual no matter the cause behind her "issues" she would have never volunteered to go into a "WAR ZONE," where she could put others at risk. Even though it is Monk's heart desire to go back to the force, he came to accept and respect Stottlemeyer's reasons. Plus back to Nikki's motivation for a minute. She didn't even volunteer to go for Iraq, for the good of the mission. It was only so she could accomplish her own goals of seeing where her brother was hurt, and to thank those who helped her family. Then she acted like an hysterical, unprofessional nutcase, almost jumping out of the humvee like that, and again putting not only Tony, but the soldiers trying to protect her life at risk. She could have caused one of them to be put in a coma like her brother or worse. She didn't think of that did she. Nor when she risked their lives to go back to give that girl a laptop. Yes Nikkie did end up helping in the case but it was incidental and at least in my book seemed like it was the secondary goal to her.
All JMHO. Sorry to be so longwinded and don't know if my reasoning makes any sense to anybody but me, but this is why I just can't see her as a lead or field agent, or as any thing other than a recurring bureaucrat office type character.
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Post by melbradford on May 1, 2008 16:18:36 GMT -5
the director is currently on vacation
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2008 16:22:01 GMT -5
Just wanting to stay in one's position is no excuse. You want to stay in the same position, fine, but never looking beyond it makes you seem unmotivated. And it's not like McGee's next presumptive promotion (senior field agent? team leader?) would take him out of the field. But what I'm not understanding is how or why that makes you look unmotivated, when there are plenty of good reasons you shouldn't do it. If Ziva had not volunteered, knowing she was Israeli and would be a liability, then that would be putting the mission first. Sure she can offer a lot, but she can also aggravate tensions and cause problems. If Nikki hadn't volunteered, knowing her limitations with OCD, she'd have been putting the mission first as well. Now we know that McGee's reason for refusing was nothing like that. But Leon didn't. There could have been a very legitimate reason why McGee would know he was a good candidate and Leon didn't take that into account before saying he was disappointed. Why not at least say "I was surprised to see you haven't come to me requesting the assignment." Plus the way they almost swarmed him for the assignment almost seemed unprofessional, probably because of the way they were trying to beat each other to the draw (and I know that was for humor). I'm not sure how Tony handled it when he applied, but I'd be worried of my supervisor being put off if I acted the way Nikki and Ziva did.
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Post by della on May 1, 2008 16:52:59 GMT -5
Speaking for myself alone I don't think my "dislike" of Nikki is based on her being a woman. I have posted about the reasons I personally dislike her before, but I'll try here to explain it better. Agreed that Nikki is trying to overcome her OCD is admirable. Hey I've had some problems with "checking" behavior myself which is also considered a part of OCD. Too Nikki may have good reasons for her behavior, that we don't fully understand yet, and her "condition" maybe exxagerated, and may indeed be temporary. She also as has been pointed out may be acting as she does to protect her brother's immune system. So Kudos to her for that selfless motivation, but here is the reason my sympathy for her is lessened by miles. As I think I may have posted in another thread, and taking Monk as an example, as another poster has done in this tread too: that show's Captain Stottlemyer pointed out: Other officer's lives are often dependent on the skill and bravery of their backup, so he could not justify testifying on Monk's behalf to offically reinstate him as a gun carrying officer. No matter how much the Captain admired Monk's detecting abilities, and cared for him as a friend, he couldn't take that kind of risk with his other fellow officers lives. The chance that one of Monk's fears would cause him to hesitate if only for a split second and put someone else in danger as a result was just too strong. Does any believe that Gibbs would have any less consideration for his agent's safety than Stottlemyer did for his officers? Come on this is Gibbs we are talking about here. If the writers were staying true to his charcter, he would have had a fit about her being chosen, IMHO. He would have gone to the wall before he let anyone take that big of a gamble with Tony's life. So the writers tried to show she could cope, but Gibbs and Tony didn't have that reassurance going in. So he couldn't have substituted Ziva because she is Israeli but surely he would have suggested Magee instead. If Nikki was a truly selfless individual no matter the cause behind her "issues" she would have never volunteered to go into a "WAR ZONE," where she could put others at risk. Even though it is Monk's heart desire to go back to the force, he came to accept and respect Stottlemeyer's reasons. Plus back to Nikki's motivation for a minute. She didn't even volunteer to go for Iraq, for the good of the mission. It was only so she could accomplish her own goals of seeing where her brother was hurt, and to thank those who helped her family. Then she acted like an hysterical, unprofessional nutcase, almost jumping out of the humvee like that, and again putting not only Tony, but the soldiers trying to protect her life at risk. She could have caused one of them to be put in a coma like her brother or worse. She didn't think of that did she. Nor when she risked their lives to go back to give that girl a laptop. Yes Nikkie did end up helping in the case but it was incidental and at least in my book seemed like it was the secondary goal to her. All JMHO. Sorry to be so longwinded and don't know if my reasoning makes any sense to anybody but me, but this is why I just can't see her as a lead or field agent, or as any thing other than a recurring bureaucrat office type character. Hello auralynn, I do agree that it was a logical decision by Stottlemeyer by not backing Monk and quoting that he did not have enough confidence to know that Monk would be able to back up a fellow officer out in the field, but it wasn’t a complete judgement against all of Monk’s abilities, because he still used/use him for his power’s of deduction, and with that Monk still went out in the field and Stottlemeyer slipped into the role of protector for Monk. Also, I think Monk has so many more problems than Nikki and I feel that until he gets some sort of resolution to Trudy’s death, then he will continue to suffer as he does with OCD. I also believe that it was said that he was a smiling, happy, easy going individual right up to the point he received the call that Trudy had died, and that it was from that moment on his problems with OCD began to escalate. His whole demeanour changed. Anyway, in my opinion, I think any serving officer would think that outsiders such as journalists, visiting politicians and so on are the bane of their existence because all it means to them is that they are now having to not only look out for their own, but also those who would have no idea on protocol, deadly areas and what not. Having said that though, I do feel that they would put in whatever it took to keep them safe, in making sure that nothing untoward would happen to them, so I think that leaving Tony and Nikki to their own devices in the back of the vehicle would have been a serious no-no and would not have happened. So it could be said that the scene where Nikki got out of the back of the vehicle had been contrived, but I like to view it as them using artistic licence. In my opinion, and I hope this is what is going to happen, I think with this episode it was to show a sort of first step in Nikki’s recovery, so that from this point on we will see her getting better with her OCD problems. If they suddenly show her as having no problems at all, then I’d probably get on my box and start a bit of grindy-teethy semi-ranting. Anyway, I do agree that the reasons for Nikki wanting to go to Iraq were selfish and there were a couple of occasions where her reasons did put others in jeopardy, but during the episode, she did put her reasons aside and worked very effectively beside Tony, when he allowed her to, such as the turpentine and recognising where she had noticed it before. She also established the time of death and while doing that they also showed us that by being practical she could do her job. I agree that she might be a liability out in the field if it came down to her having to fire a gun, but then would it be imperative that she would need to know how to fire a gun? Agent Lee went out in the field as an undercover agent, without carrying a gun, and the others were there to back her up. Compared to the others I think McGee spends a lot more time in the office than out in the field, so I do think that Nikki could become an effective Agent back in the Office and at Crime Scenes, given that it ahs been shown she can wear gloves, and I think that as her OCD problems begin to lessen, I think then she could be trained as a out-in-the-field Agent. All in all, I think there are a lot of possibilities with the Nikki character that I wouldn’t mind seeing explored. I’d hate for her to have had this episode and then for it to be forgotten in a flash. Also, I think the clever thing they did here was to show that the decision as to who was to go to Iraq was entirely Leon’s. I think they could have shown a scene where Gibbs contended his decision concerning Nikki, but to be honest, the reason Leon gave as to why he was choosing Nikki over Ziva was understandable and to be honest the correct one. Gibbs might have viewed it the same way *shrug* As for Leon not picking McGee, in my opinion, that was all to do with McGee not volunteering. Iraq is a volatile place where, no matter how much back-up you have, you can quite easily lose your life, which I think it was why Leon made it a request for volunteers rather than an order... And because McGee never put himself forward, it could be construed that he didn’t want to go. We were shown that that wasn’t true, that the reason McGee didn’t volunteer was because he was trying to out psyche Tony, but Leon wasn’t to know that. But still, even if he was he aware, officially he still couldn’t choose Mcgee to go because he hadn’t volunteered and on the off-chance that one of them may have lost their life out there, I’m sure that the official report would have stated that either one of them had volunteered and therefore were aware of the dangers. Phew! Sorry about that
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Post by melbradford on May 1, 2008 19:28:40 GMT -5
choosing someone who didn't volunteer could have been a liability to all the people involved, if someone doesn't want to be somewhere or be doing something, regardless of the job, performance is affected .... and in a warzone that could cause serious problems
i think if leon had known the whole situation he may have chosen his words a little better, but he doesn't
and mcgee should know better than to trust tony
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Post by MrClark on May 1, 2008 22:00:48 GMT -5
But what I'm not understanding is how or why that makes you look unmotivated, when there are plenty of good reasons you shouldn't do it. If Ziva had not volunteered, knowing she was Israeli and would be a liability, then that would be putting the mission first. Sure she can offer a lot, but she can also aggravate tensions and cause problems. If Nikki hadn't volunteered, knowing her limitations with OCD, she'd have been putting the mission first as well. This is a competitive field, it was a coveted assignment. There was a rumor about it in the entire agency (per Ziva, in the bathroom with Nikki). Stepping up and volunteering for a mission is considered, as sheep said, showing initiative. Ziva felt she could do the mission, it was Leon who said it wasn't a good idea. There was no reason why she had to tell the people in Iraq she was Israeli, she could have gone and no one would have known, but the acting director didn't feel that way. No one in the United States government would have let Ziva go over there. Israel and Iraq are to have as little to do with each other as possible, at least thats the US gov't's stance. If the Iraqi's found out she was Mossad it would have been a nightmare. Directors of federal agencies can't just say 'well if she gets in and out and know ones the wiser'. During the first Iraq war the US did everything it could to keep Israel on the sideline while Scuds were raining down on Haifa and Tel Aviv. If Israel had so much as thought about getting involved the hole Muslim community would have been in an uproar. Ziva was extremely naive to think she had a snowballs chance in hell of going.
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Post by sheep on May 2, 2008 0:08:14 GMT -5
I think she was trying to pull a fast one on Vance, attempting to get in on the international mission because she hoped he didn't realize she was Mossad. Although I doubt that he was brought in for that exact reason in this ep, it would have be interesting to see if she'd tried the same ploy on Jenny.
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Post by MrClark on May 2, 2008 0:45:17 GMT -5
I think she was trying to pull a fast one on Vance, attempting to get in on the international mission because she hoped he didn't realize she was Mossad. Although I doubt that he was brought in for that exact reason in this ep, it would have be interesting to see if she'd tried the same ploy on Jenny. She must have been thinking something along those lines. Personally i think her main reason for wanting to go is hidden in the spoiler as its probably to shippy for this thread. She knew Tony would be going and wanted to be the one to go with him. She was quite clearly jealous of Nikki's being there with him, i think.
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